Ex-Husband Wants to Return Stuff 10 Years Later
Her ex-husband wants to return stuff — mostly his old, moldy letters — and insists on seeing her 10 years after the divorce. She can say no, right?
***
Dear Chump Lady,
Your site has really helped me come to terms with the mindless, carelessness of the cheater and helped me trust they suck. I found you because we share a mutual fascination with the train wreck that is David Brooks.
I truly thought it was finally Tuesday when it came to my feelings about my ex.
First boyfriend, five years dating, 23 years of marriage, two kids. He didn’t seem to like me much (about 95% of the time), so I asked for a divorce and suddenly I’m gobsmacked with D-Day à la Elliot Spitzer. I’m now solidly over ten years out from the divorce decree with an ensuing custody battle thrown in by him for grins and finally landed on my feet in really great shape.
So, until today, I thought I was living my best chump life and enjoying cheering on other chumps on as they grapple with the creature that is the F***wit.
Perhaps the Chump Gods thought I was too smug and needed a refresher because evidently my ex is moving to Asia (!?!?!) and wants to personally drop off a box of letters.
He’s been asking around for my address.
The loyal friends I have left, and who actually know where I live, have conveniently developed amnesia when it comes to my exact location. They have offered to deliver the box to me for him (and perhaps torch it while en route to my undisclosed location), but he has made it clear he wants to deliver it himself.
I suddenly find myself wondering, why now? What is the mature thing to do? Am I being the b**** he has painted me out to be to others?
It’s actually embarrassingly confusing after so many years of recovering from the horrors of the reality of who he really was and thinking it was Tuesday. Suddenly, I’m doubting myself, who I am, what I’ve accomplished. And, honestly, feeling a little preyed upon. My gut say, run the other way.
I truly don’t want anything to do with him, but somehow feel guilty.
I would love feedback. Is this something other chumps have seen with their aged F***wit? I need moral support!
Thank you,
Day Chump Believer
Ps. I don’t know or care who these letters are from as I’ve ditched most nostalgia from my life and live in the present.
***
Dear Day Chump Believer,
If you’ve lived without him and that stuff for 10 years, you can keep living without it.
He’s just hoovering. It’s what FWs do. Perhaps narcissistic supply has run low and he needs a kibble hit. Perhaps Mercury is in the seventh moon of Jupiter. Who knows his motivations? He’s just a pathetic man in need of centrality. So he’ll rummage around his desk, or moldy basement, and come up with some excuse to contact you.
PAPERS! I have PAPERS!
Dude, contact your local senior center. They have those shredding events. Don’t call your ex-wife.
But FWs gotta be FWs.
evidently my ex is moving to Asia (!?!?!) and wants to personally drop off a box of letters.
Uh-huh. And I personally want to drop an anvil on his wandering dick. But we don’t get to do all the things we want to do.
Just because he has a desire doesn’t mean you have to fulfill it. Boundaries don’t make you churlish and uncivil, they make you sane.
This is not a safe man.
He had a double life with paid (cough) girlfriends for how long? He risked your health by schtupping strange for how long? And then, not content with that heap of abuse, he sued you for custody when you filed for a divorce? And you survived ALL THAT and would give up your sanity for what? A pile of moldering paper?
So HIS feelings aren’t hurt?
F*ck his feelings.
You know why a guy like that is moving to Asia, of course.
To study Buddhist temples, Tracy? Join a monastery? Dig wells for impoverished villages?
How to put this delicately and not set off the censor bots… seggs tourism. Unfettered misogyny. Google “passport Bros.” (Dear God, this phenomenon has a name. I just thought it was my mail for the last 14 years.)
But before he waddles off to greener pussy pastures, he needs to torment you one last time. (Or really forever. Geography cannot end his torment.) Just break no contact! Tell him your address!
Stay no contact.
The loyal friends I have left, and who actually know where I live, have conveniently developed amnesia when it comes to my exact location.
Good.
They have offered to deliver the box to me for him (and perhaps torch it while en route to my undisclosed location), but he has made it clear he wants to deliver it himself.
They too can learn to hang up phones and delete text messages. There is no conversation to be had here.
I suddenly find myself wondering, why now?
Why not now? It doesn’t matter. He’s not safe.
What is the mature thing to do?
Value yourself above a man hellbent on hurting you.
Am I being the b**** he has painted me out to be to others?
Who cares? What’s he going to do? Bend the ear of some 14-year-old bar maid in Thailand?
Let’s weigh the crimes of a double life, health risk, and custody lawsuit against the transgression of Will Not Accept My Box of Letters.
Why are you even asking me this?!
Suddenly, I’m doubting myself, who I am, what I’ve accomplished. And, honestly, feeling a little preyed upon. My gut say, run the other way.
You had a little wobble. Now return to no contact and your much happier FW-free life. He and his box of crap are moving to another continent. You’re winning this.
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Yeah, no. The fact that he won’t just let mutual friends return the box shows that it’s not about getting the box back to you, it’s about getting his way.
He and his box can f*** off.
That is exactly the point–his insisting on doing it in person means he only want on final opportunity to dominate. He can eff off all the way to Asia.
Day Chump Believer,
You have lived without this stuff for 10 years; ergo, you don’t need it. The answer is a polite “no thank you” through an intermediary, with no explanation necessary … even if your FW wants one so that he can have the additional pleasure of arguing with you about it.
I strongly suspect that your FW wants some centrality and a bit of control, as there’s nothing a Cheater likes half as much as giving their Chump a push to make them wobble and to remind themselves that they still have some power over you.
F*ck him and f*ck his noise..
LFTT
I wouldn’t even bother with the “No thank you.” Just ignore. I might be a bit worried though that her friends? still apparently have some contact with him.
I agree…no words are needed. Just action. The only thing cheater comprehend anyway.
THIS
Chumpnomore6,
I prefer to let silence convey the desired message (I communicate with Ex-Mrs LFTT as little as is physically possible), but when it comes to boundaries, I find that there is less scope for her to deliberately misinterpret things (as is her way) if I’ve made the boundary abundantly clear.
The last time I had to do this, I used my MIL (who I am on excellent terms with) as an intermediary to shut down some of Ex-Mrs LFTT’s more egregious BS.
LFTT
Totally off topic, but it’s delightful to see someone correctly use “whom”, as well as one of my favorite words (egregious), and a profanity (albeit a mild one) all in one sentence.
ISawTheLight,
Glad I could bring some delight to your day!
LFTT
Do whatever you have to do to forget the whole thing. Every second that this is in your brain is deliberate abuse. Dont give one more second of your precious serenity to that loser.
DDay, after decades of marriage, was just before COVID, and tween and I were both high risk and could not go out. FW emailed and “graciously offered to get groceries for us. When I told him that his friend could drop them at the front door, he mentioned that friend would come in to get a different piece of sports equipment than the one he had. When I refused, and kept the boundary that friend could leave them at the door, his “charm” switched immediately to rage. He said he could not risk his friend’s health by asking friend to make a no-contact delivery. Seems the whole thing was an excuse to get into the house himself.
It’s quite possible that ex is NOT moving to Asia, and that’s just another lie to make you and friends think it’s “safe” to let him know where you live, or to misdirect anyone looking for him.
He either wants to see you, or know where you live, and I suspect his goal is to harm you, either now or later, directly or indirectly. Please thank your friends for continuing to hide your location and urge them not to give away ANY info about you. If he already tried to sue your for custody, this might be his way to get to your child. And if he really is moving, the last thing you want is for him to abduct and take your child to parts unknown. The paper he has could be the birth certificate naming him as the father, and he could probably get a new one by showing ID and requesting one.
Stay strong!
I missed the Asia part.
Yes, it could be just a little added drama thrown in for attention.
Or a blessing…he’ll be so far away that he’ll effectively disappear. And you don’t necessarily have to bother inviting him to the graduations and weddings. My adult kids want nothing to do with Dad, so that part has been easy-peasy. He lives in a different state and has been absent from our lives for a while.
A pathetic hoovering attempt, that’s all. Just ignore. I do wonder though, and think it a bit worrying, that people who purport to be friends of yours are still available for him to contact, and they in turn contact you- why?!. Maybe I’m being overly cynical, but that’s a red flag for me. In any case, there’s absolutely no need to respond to this rubbish in any way whatsoever, why would you even contemplate doing so?!
Additionally, if he manages to convince someone to drop off a box at your house, you’re not obligated to read them. You can shred them immediately. Or you can stick them in the attic and shred them in five years when you’re moving or cleaning out the attic.
You can make it harder for him to deliver them but ultimately you can’t really prevent him from dropping a box on your doorstep. (In this day and age it’s pretty difficult to completely conceal your address). But he can’t make you read them: that is the real locus of control that you have.
I had a box of wedding announcements, cards, and memorabilia that I put off looking at. I knew where it was in my basement, and last summer I went through it with one of my adult kids and ditched it all. She also helped me divide all the pictures during the closeout, some years before, as required by the divorce agreement.
It felt really good to get that done.
I did the something similar: I left a box in the attic for about 7 years. It would have been very difficult to go through in the early days but by the time I got around to it I was mostly just annoyed that I had to deal with it.
Luckily (I guess) I didn’t have to make any difficult choices in the first phase of this – putting all the stuff in the attic – because we hadn’t even finished unpacking from a big move. I just shoved a bunch of the moving boxes into the attic without even opening them and left them for a half decade.
LOL. Love these common experiences.
My daughter and I did have some good laughs over it, BTW. Oh, weddings in the 1990’s. Nothing like today.
If my daughter marries, she says she’s going to wear a dress of her choosing, whatever color and style she wants. Married at the courthouse, and then a party at a restaurant. Her childhood bestie did that and scandalized her very conservative parents. When they ranted to me, I just smiled. Yes, their daughter is VERY cool.
It’s no coincidence that, traditionally, brides *buy* their wedding dresses and grooms *rent* their tux!
Yes, although my daughter says that many guys just buy a good suit now that they can rewear.
Makes sense to me.
My concern would be, if some important legal or personal documents are in the pile. but it seems like FW real goal is to see you in person.
Perhaps to gloat, or play the pity party scene, or even to physically harm you. FW narcopath had similar predilections as your ex.
What exactly are these papers? Can you get a photo or scans?
Was it here at CL I read about how these FW only care about their di*CKS and in old age while dying the Thai ho*ker would step over him to grab his wallet? Yeah I’m at a point where that’s my stance, where’s the money, useless FW?
Klootzak uses my child to do this. He drops DS11 off and in walks our child with some odd thing that klootzak wants me to take. I have trashed most of it. He took all my recipes and digital photos but he most recently needed me to take a beautiful antique pen and ink drawing I had purchased for him as a gift (and had matted and framed) back. DS11 came in the door with it in a bag. I don’t approve of this using our child to transport things and hope it will soon end. The crazy thing is, I really do think this wall hanging is gorgeous. When I look at it, I remember finding it in New Orleans. I was on a business trip. Klootzak wasn’t with me. It reminds me of that lovely place. Klootzak always loved antique pen and ink drawings but when I see it, I remember the day I was there and eating beignets. I don’t think of him. So I am considering hanging it up, which I realize may seem weird. It’s not the first time klootzak threw away something of value.
What I struggle with is whether there is a way to shut this down for our child. He is not a carrier pigeon. I think it’s beyond my control. DS11 doesn’t seem bothered but still, it’s not right.
When I was taking the court mandated parenting classes, it was pretty clearly stated that children are not to be used as messengers or go-betweens. You may want to consider a letter from your lawyer, or sending a letter yourself and letting FW know that if the behavior continues you will be involving your lawyer (that may be enough to deter him).
This is your son being groomed to be a go between and it will haunt him. Shut that down if you can. This happened to me and it was so awful for my son, he was made to feel “”special” but really it was coercive control stuff.
My ex tried to use our child, too. In the middle of the divorce, he refused to fill out her FAFSA forms (for college aid) unless she talked to him. She was hysterical. I had to file an “Emergency Motion to Require Respondent to Prepare FAFSA Forms to Preserve Community Estate.” He filled them out before we could hold a hearing. Daughter is now on year 11 of No Contact and he is a very sad sausage who doesn’t understand the hate.
My youngest was here for dinner yesterday and commented that she and her sibling are on year 7 of no contact. Time flies! Her romantic partner has a graduate school graduation next month and is going crazy with his divorced parents and their drama. Well, not a problem on her side, at least.
3 years after my divorce was finalized, my FW tried to get me to break no contact. He sent me a copy of my latest credit card statement. Apparently, he could still access this formerly joint credit card information online. He claimed he had been trying to fix the problem for the past 3 years. Wanted me to help him figure out how to cancel his access to it.
Understandably, I went ballistic with the bank. While I have nothing to hide, my FW had no right to have access to my credit card transactions. I immediately contacted the bank and I sorted the problem out within days. At no point was direct communication with my FW necessary.
My point is that you do not need to break no contact. If you want the crap, then ask a friend to accept it on your behalf. You can collect it later and then decide what to do with it. If you don’t want the crap, then do nothing. As others have said, you have lived 10 years without even knowing this stuff existed. Pretty safe to assume it has no value to you now – if it ever did.
“Just because he has a desire doesn’t mean you have to fulfill it.” Amen to that!!!
But I do get how the OP’s nervous system gets activated by this contact. Even if your cognitive self knows not to engage and trusts that he sucks, your nervous system gets stirred up and old patterns of people pleasing and avoiding his negative reactions are triggered.
Don’t respond at all. Deprive him of supply. If it were important and if he respected you and your boundaries, he’d mail it to a friend’s address. He’s an entitled jerk who’s used to getting his way.
Isn’t this the point at which you contact your original divorce attorney, express your fear of harassment, and send him a nice registered letter? Or if you can’t afford that and he DOES show up, just don’t answer the door. Or you could drop by Goodwill, pick up a lot of ratty underwear, box it all up, and have it by the door ready to hand to HIM.
I LOVE THIS. If you have the money, contact your lawyer. As Tracy said, this man is not safe!
No way. My ex left nearly nine years ago. That was followed by an ugly separation and even more awful divorce and closeout. Early in closeout, he wanted me to mail him something of his. I did, but only because my gut was OK with that and because I discussed the implications with my attorney. I sent it the slowest way possible. Later, when we were mostly done, he asked for something else. Couldn’t find it (as if I looked, NOT).
If he suddenly reappeared in any way, I’d ignore him. If he “insisted” and somehow got hold of me or someone close to me, I wouldn’t be available any time, any way. Don’t contact me again.
I’m just fine being the horrible, dangerously crazy person he says I am. Liar!
Many years ago, I was driving home and one of my young kids was in the back of the car, screaming. I couldn’t get home fast enough and I remember screaming myself, “fuuuuuuuuuuuuuck”!
I pulled into the driveway, happy to be home but feeling really guilty because I was a bad mom for screaming back. I then realized I had been screaming in my head. Not a bad mom, I was just thinking on the inside and remaining calm on the outside.
Hang in there DCB, and continue on with your Tuesdays.
The gif of the strange man finding paper sent me into wild laughter.
I appreciate all the advice you are getting to NOT allow your FW to know where you live and drop crap off because if I were in that situation, I would do the wrong thing.
My Cheater died before I learned the length and breadth of his betrayal (and we all know that we generally only get the tip of the iceberg, so there was likely more).
I so wish that I just once had a chance to look into his face with him knowing that I KNEW. I have a fantasy that it would be satisfying to call him on his crap.
and yet
All the experienced Chumps here tell us over and over that closure is not real and the experience I envy didnt help them in any meaningful ways. Listen to them and not me.
I will exit my declining years looking forward to running into Cheater in Purgatory so than I can look him in the face (and I dont think we have the option of lying in Purgatory). If you see me in either Purgatory or Heaven and want to ask me how it worked out for me, feel free to ask.
Thank you for appreciating my GIF game. It made me LOL too!
Beware of tracking devices in the box/bundle. From your letter it seems he does not know where you live. If there is some underlying reason beyond no contact peace of mind for EX not knowing where you live then be very wary of any box making its way to your house.
That’s what I was thinking. Or a device that can record and transmit over the Internet to spy on her. Or, absolute worse case, a b*mb. Yes, I know, I read too many thrillers
Yes, a thing. Send a package with a tag to the post office box or to the friend/relative receiving their mail and see where it ends up.
Good point! He definitely sounds as is he’s be capable of something like that. He misses messing with her life and wants another shot at it.
I immediately had the same thought as CL about why he’s moving to Asia. 🤢
Chump Believer, you have nothing to feel guilty about. The fact that FW brings up those kind of feelings is why it’s dangerous to see him. He’ll be able to manipulate you with guilt. CL is right, he’s just looking for kibbles. Paying for it isn’t as satisfying as manipulating people into feeling sorry for him and giving him attention and sympathy. That’s high grade kibble. So please don’t see him. Let it be known to him through your friends that you don’t want the letters and he needs to stop trying to find you because you consider it stalking and are willing to get legal about it. That might scare him off.
Yes and my last cheater was moving with his 20 year younger wife to the Phillipines where her family lives!!! But he hasn’t gone yet!! Why????? Why?? Then I know my friend took care of her cheater IN HOSPICE after she divorced him for getting her and his first ex wife Pregnant AT THE SAME TIME!!
This why we are chumps forever and ever. The FEELING BAD after the shoved us off a cliff and we climbed back out!! What is that!!!??
Your friends need to mind their own business and not let cheater even talk to them about you. Shut that down, no messages!!!! Any conversation yes or no, pro or con with this cheater is still kibbles! She’s mad or she still cares or her friends still connect with.me.kibbles. Stop ✋️ and No. Two words all chumps like me need to learn. And never forget. NO. PERIOD
But I have to say the graphics are hilarious today ( every day)especially the paper more paper one!! Oh my goodness. I split my britches laughing .
Absolutely nothing wrong with maintaining no-contact and ignoring his requests. But… what about a little malicious compliance? Find a really smelly meetup spot. Maybe there’s a parking lot on a Monday morning downwind from a seafood restaurant dumpster? Or perhaps a dairy farm nearby. Set a date and time to meet him to pick up the box and no-show? See how long he’s willing to hang around smellville?
If he manages to find out where you live, do not, under any circumstance, open the door, and promptly call 911. There is zero reason for this guy to be contacting you at this time. If his stupid papers were so important, he would’ve given them to you earlier. There could be fleas, lice or bedbugs in the pile of papers. Day Chump Believer, you are awesome without his debris. You owe him nothing, and in fact, he owes you the respect of honoring your no contact. No means no, and it’s too bad that he doesn’t like it.
I can’t upvote your comment enough.
This guy is an abuser! Who cares what he thinks?
Amen! Thank you!!!
Oh, he wants SOMETHING, and it’s not a sincere desire to reunite you with letters.
Otherwise he would have no problem with a go-between delivering them to you.
Which means that this is a game.
I say ignore ignore ignore.
If I need water and the well is dry, I don’t stand around figuring out why the well is dry. I keep looking for a new well.
Why this man wants to contact you in person does not matter. You need a glass of water, not more BS to scrape off your shoes.
What matters is that he has (surprise, surprise!) a hidden agenda and is not being upfront about his true motives. In other words, doing what cheaters do.
I now stay very far away from anyone who is playing games and not being straightforward with me.
Don’t feed the monster.
♥️
This rings so true! Thank you!!
Thank you all for the supportive comments! CL has his number and he is definitely a Passport Bro posing as an English teacher! No contact it is after reading through all the insightful comments! I appreciate the concern about my “freinds”. It’s actually my housekeeper who stayed on and worked for him after the divorce and basically watched out for my children and kept me informed as to what was going on over at his house when the youngest was still a minor. Since he is moving to Asia, she will no longer work for him, but she warned me on Saturday that he wants to see me and would not let her take the box. She wanted me to have the heads up and knew not to tell him where I lived. I really can’t even imagine what’s going on in his twisted brain, but will definitely be on the lookout until I hear he has left the country! Thank you all for the feedback!!!
If you don’t have security cameras, might be worth getting them. If he shows up, don’t answer the door, call the cops.
This man abused you relentlessly for years. He’s dangerous, and you owe him NOTHING. There is NO benefit to having contact with him, let alone telling him where you live!
I have a ring camera set up!
Most likely Chump Lady is right, and this is about kibbles. Probably. Although maybe he intends to put something in that box besides letters…
However, the fact that he insists on personally delivering it scares me. It really sets off my alarm bells. Maybe he intends to ass*ult you, or, even k*ll you to wipe the slate clean, so to speak.Maybe I’m being paranoid, but, maybe not.
I would be very, very careful, and step up your personal security precautions just in case he does find your address. It’s not difficult at all; there are lots of websites with that information.
OMG, this is the part of the movie where the monster has been fought off, hit in a head with a shovel and is now lying dead in the corner. But the movie goers know, having seen a million monster movies before..what the protagonist does not. The monster is not really dead! Soon it will lurch to it’s feet, even more dangerous than before, and try again to maim and murder.
Jump in your car and jet on outta there, OP! Hit the eject button and punch out through the roof! Call in friendly fire and lock yourself in your bullet-proof bunker! In short, whatever you have to do to keep the letter-seeking monster away, you do that thing.
Lots of good advice here. You don’t want or need anything he’s got. He is certainly up to something, and it doesn’t matter what. Keep going no contact.
When my ex left after 20-some years, he kept contacting me for various items he had left behind. So I took loads of his stuff in several trips, and left boxes on the porch and driveway of the secret house he had bought (while he was not home). He continued over the years to try to contact me at various times (in between girlfriends, apparently) using stupid excuses. The kids and I had kept our home and I had the same phone number because of elderly relatives. He took a few trips to Asia to try to find a “wife.” Eventually he quit work, let everything he had fall into foreclosure so he wouldn’t have to pay what he owed me from the court settlement, and moved out of state (1,500 miles away). I had huge tubs of divorce documents and evidence that I kept for many years out of fear, just in case. Then a couple of years ago I heard that he died. A year after that, I took everything from the tubs to friends’ house and burned it all in their firepit. We sat around with drinks and snacks and watched the flames consume the past awfulness. Very cathartic and freeing.